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REPEAT ORDER

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REPEAT ORDER

Post by nestrevencion on Wed Aug 26, 2009 12:04 pm

how possible is the inter-agency repeat order? who/what committee monitors the public bidding awards implemented by agencies to be the basis of this inter-agency repeat order? thank you Cool
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Re: REPEAT ORDER

Post by engrjhez® on Wed Aug 26, 2009 1:27 pm

nestrevencion wrote:how possible is the inter-agency repeat order? who/what committee monitors the public bidding awards implemented by agencies to be the basis of this inter-agency repeat order? thank you Cool

If you mean inter-agency as in government office to a government office, Repeat Order may not be appropriate. Instead, you may use Negotiated Procurement (Sec.53.e in the old IRR, Agency to Agency in the new IRR). Repeat order may only be resorted after a successful conduct of public bidding. Very Happy
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Re: REPEAT ORDER

Post by msm326 on Thu Aug 27, 2009 10:34 am

Good day...with COA circular 2009-001 , submission of contracts to the COA then our COA team basically check the proceedings of our procurement process so perhaps they could check if it is within the provisions of RA 9184 and if not then they can issue AOM stating the violations on RA 9184.

on Negotiated procurement refer to Alternative Mode of Procurement and you could have an array of conditions that would meet you query per particular conditions...agency to agency like PS , it is not subject to audit and there is no repeat order ....

Repeat Order can be done after a successful public bidding and there is also a limit of 25% per item that was bidded.
msm326 Very Happy
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Re: REPEAT ORDER

Post by marriola on Wed Apr 07, 2010 4:00 pm

hola!
how many times can we conduct repeat order?
thanks in advance
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Re: REPEAT ORDER

Post by riddler on Wed Apr 07, 2010 6:14 pm

marriola wrote:hola!
how many times can we conduct repeat order?
thanks in advance


Section 51. Repeat Order

Repeat Order, when provided for in the APP, is a method of procurement of goods from the
previous winning bidder, whenever there is a need to replenish goods procured under a
contract previously awarded through Competitive Bidding. Repeat orders shall likewise be
subject to the following conditions:

" x x x x.

c) Except in cases duly approved by the GPPB, the repeat order shall be availed of only
within six (6) months from the contract effectivity date stated in the Notice to Proceed
arising from the original contract; and

d) The repeat order shall not exceed twenty-five percent (25%) of the quantity of each
item in the original contract
.

I think you can always make as many Repeat Orders as you can long as it is within the conditions set forth in the above Sections of the IRR, espescially paragraph d). Very Happy Very Happy
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Re: REPEAT ORDER

Post by RDV @ GP3i on Thu Apr 08, 2010 6:24 pm

marriola wrote:hola!
how many times can we conduct repeat order?
thanks in advance

I think you can conduct Repeat Order of goods procured thru Competitive Bidding only once after that, subject to the conditions provided under Sec. 51 of the IRR.

If you conduct it more than once, then that could already be prima facie evidence of splitting of contracts. One of the conditions for Repeat Order is that it will not result to splitting of contracts.
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Re: REPEAT ORDER

Post by jcolas on Sat Apr 10, 2010 12:06 am

hola!
how many times can we conduct repeat order?
thanks in advance

Repeat Order can be availed of only once. It would not only be violative of the conditions on splitting as cited by Sir RDV, but it would also be circumventing and violative of the condition that the Repeat Order should not exceed 25%of the quantity of each item of the original contract. This simply means that when we use Repeat Order as a mode of procurement, the Procuring entity should get the maximum 25% of each item as the subject of the Repeat Order. It would be irrational if the Procuring entity will do it differently.
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Re: REPEAT ORDER

Post by sunriser431 on Sat Apr 10, 2010 8:03 am

Follow up question.
If the original contract was awarded thru competitive bidding, how is it possible (repeat order) be violative of splitting of contract.? bounce as of this morning, arriving Cagayan city for vacation with family and friends. (thanks to Mr, Smart Bro at least connected pa rin in this forum). it took almost 9 hours by land. (Zamboanga port to CDO) heh heh. see you later guys.
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Re: REPEAT ORDER

Post by RDV @ GP3i on Sat Apr 10, 2010 9:11 am

sunriser431 wrote:Follow up question.
If the original contract was awarded thru competitive bidding, how is it possible (repeat order) be violative of splitting of contract.? bounce as of this morning, arriving Cagayan city for vacation with family and friends. (thanks to Mr, Smart Bro at least connected pa rin in this forum). it took almost 9 hours by land. (Zamboanga port to CDO) heh heh. see you later guys.

Enjoy your vacation, sunriser. But it seems you don't want to miss the "fun" and the "excitement" which this forum also provides.

First, if a procuring entity makes another order, that would be a ReRepeat Order and no longer Repeat Order Very Happy (just want to give you the fun you deserve). Seriously, a 2nd Repeat Order would no longer be true to the definition of Repeat Order which is to replenish goods procured under a contract previously awarded through Competitive Bidding. In a 2nd Repeat Order, the previous contract would be the (1st) Repeat Order.

Second, because of that, it would no longer satisfy the condition under Sec. 51(b) that Repeat Order will not result in splitting of contracts, requisitions, or purchase orders as provided for in Sec. 54.1.

Third, as jcolas pointed out, it is always possible that you would violate the last condition that it shall not exceed 25% of the quantity of each item in the original contract.
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Re: REPEAT ORDER

Post by Niwram on Sat Apr 10, 2010 10:25 am

marriola wrote:hola!
how many times can we conduct repeat order?
thanks in advance

you can only conduct repeat order only once..
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Re: REPEAT ORDER

Post by engrjhez® on Sun Apr 11, 2010 2:23 am

Niwram wrote:
marriola wrote:hola!
how many times can we conduct repeat order?
thanks in advance

you can only conduct repeat order only once..

I agree.

Otherwise, it will be either REPEATED ORDER or REPEATING ORDER. Smile
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Re: REPEAT ORDER

Post by riddler on Mon Apr 12, 2010 12:10 pm

RDV @ GPPPI wrote:
marriola wrote:hola!
how many times can we conduct repeat order?
thanks in advance

I think you can conduct Repeat Order of goods procured thru Competitive Bidding only once after that, subject to the conditions provided under Sec. 51 of the IRR.

If you conduct it more than once, then that could already be prima facie evidence of splitting of contracts. One of the conditions for Repeat Order is that it will not result to splitting of contracts.

rdv, I believed that Repeat Orders are cumulative (up to 25%) as long as it is compliant with Sec. 51 of the IRR... the same is true with Variation Orders for Infrastucture which is also cumulative up to 10%. Very Happy
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Re: REPEAT ORDER

Post by Guest on Mon Apr 12, 2010 2:49 pm

I agree with riddler that it may be cumulative or done once provided that the quantity shall not exceed the 25% threshold.

There is no specific permission or prohibition provided in the provisions. Except the splitting of contract and the conditions under repeat order.

In short the provision of the law is silent on the matter if such mode of procurement may be done once or twice.

Having no exact prohibition, then we could assume that in doing a cumulative repeat order no provisions of the RA 9184 and its IRR is violated. (this is subject to the conditions of repeat order and justification of no splitting of contracts)

Variation order provides that the work may be cumulative.

Kasi nga naman pag mag repeat order ng 25% of the quantity at one time baka naman sumobra ung items and it will not be beneficial sa GOP or if below 25% ung repeat order of the quantity baka naman magkulang kung hindi pwede ung cumulative. Mas efficient kung cumulative, wala namang prohibition basta justify that there is no splitting of contracts.

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Re: REPEAT ORDER

Post by riddler on Mon Apr 12, 2010 4:50 pm

amen, ligaw na binatog.. sometimes, you cannot do Repeat Orders at once kasi the goods may have different schedules of deliveries for different items, at saka din natin alam yung actual changes along the way sa project/goods on the part nang PE's... Say yung item A, kulang ng 5% si item B naman e kulang ng 10% and so on... that is why, in my opinion talagang cumulative yung Repeat Orders of the the total Contract Cost to be not more than 25%. Very Happy
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Re: REPEAT ORDER

Post by engrjhez® on Mon Apr 12, 2010 4:59 pm

To Riddler and LNB,

True that there are no specific rules on how Repeat Order may be undertaken but for sure, one common prohibition is splitting of contracts to circumvent the bidding process. Lets take one example for the case of an LGU:

Purchase of Item X worth 1,200.00/ea (1000 units). ABC is P1,200,000.00. Fast forward>>> After the Bidding, award was given at a contract price of P1,000,000.00 (ie @P1,000.00/ea). If it will be allowed to do Repeat Order cumulatively, that is the same as ordering, say 125 units twice. Under strict rules of AMP, this cannot be done by shopping nor negotiated procurement. On the other hand, repeat order can be allowed up to 250 units using the same or lower unit price (take note that full 25% amounts to P250,000.00). Doing it by 2 separate repeat orders (125 units each) constitutes violation by splitting because there will be two contracts of similar items.

A suggested cure to meet your suggestion will be doing it by one Repeat Order (full 25%) but allowing partial payments on partial deliveries. If the full quantity will be consumed, ok lang. If not, ok din kasi hindi naman sila babayaran in full for partial deliveries.

"When the law does not distinguish, we should not distinguish." The general rules apply. Very Happy
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Re: REPEAT ORDER

Post by riddler on Mon Apr 12, 2010 5:18 pm

engrjhez® wrote:
To Riddler and LNB,

True that there are no specific rules on how Repeat Order may be undertaken but for sure, one common prohibition is splitting of contracts to circumvent the bidding process. Lets take one example for the case of an LGU:

Purchase of Item X worth 1,200.00/ea (1000 units). ABC is P1,200,000.00. Fast forward>>> After the Bidding, award was given at a contract price of P1,000,000.00 (ie @P1,000.00/ea). If it will be allowed to do Repeat Order cumulatively, that is the same as ordering, say 125 units twice. Under strict rules of AMP, this cannot be done by shopping nor negotiated procurement. On the other hand, repeat order can be allowed up to 250 units using the same or lower unit price (take note that full 25% amounts to P250,000.00). Doing it by 2 separate repeat orders (125 units each) constitutes violation by splitting because there will be two contracts of similar items.

A suggested cure to meet your suggestion will be doing it by one Repeat Order (full 25%) but allowing partial payments on partial deliveries. If the full quantity will be consumed, ok lang. If not, ok din kasi hindi naman sila babayaran in full for partial deliveries.

"When the law does not distinguish, we should not distinguish." The general rules apply. Very Happy

let me add another example engrjhez, Very Happy Say nag procure ng 1,000 tabs antibiotics, 1,000 syringes, 1,000 paracetamol, 1,000 tabs hypertensions, etc. yung Health Dept natin. during the the initial implementation ng project eh kulang pala yung antibiotics sa actual participants, without knowing na kulang din pa la yung ibang health items, sympre Repeat Order sya for antibiotics only, at the middle of the project eh dumami yung nagpatule, sympre ddagdag sya additonal syringes (wala ata anaesthesia ah scratch ), and so on.. in sum, pwd talaga cumulative repeat orders engrjhez.. i would opine na nadistinguish naman talaga sa IRR. Very Happy
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Re: REPEAT ORDER

Post by engrjhez® on Mon Apr 12, 2010 5:38 pm

riddler wrote:
let me add another example engrjhez, Very Happy Say nag procure ng 1,000 tabs antibiotics, 1,000 syringes, 1,000 paracetamol, 1,000 tabs hypertensions, etc. yung Health Dept natin. during the the initial implementation ng project eh kulang pala yung antibiotics sa actual participants, without knowing na kulang din pa la yung ibang health items, sympre Repeat Order sya for antibiotics only, at the middle of the project eh dumami yung nagpatule, sympre ddagdag sya additonal syringes (wala ata anaesthesia ah scratch ), and so on.. in sum, pwd talaga cumulative repeat orders engrjhez.. i would opine na nadistinguish naman talaga sa IRR. Very Happy

Q: What's the difference between your suggestion and mine?
A: The number of contracts/PO executed.

I understand your point, but the execution may not be appropriate since multiple contracts of the same nature is the same as splitting contracts. It may be more tedious to post and process several Repeat Orders (originating from 1 bidded contract). Plus, quoting the conditions of repeat order:

a) Unit prices of the repeat order must be the same as or lower than those in the original
contract, provided that such prices are still the most advantageous to the GOP after
price verification;
b) The repeat order will not result in splitting of contracts, requisitions, or purchase
orders, as provided for in Section 54.1 of this IRR;
c) Except in cases duly approved by the GPPB, the repeat order shall be availed of only
within six (6) months from the contract effectivity date stated in the Notice to Proceed
arising from the original contract; and
d) The repeat order shall not exceed twenty-five percent (25%) of the quantity of each
item in the original contract.

It would be clearer to see that the intention of the law is to issue one Repeat order per Public Bidding. Otherwise, it should be "...repeat orders..." with the absence of "the". Very Happy
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Re: REPEAT ORDER

Post by Guest on Tue Apr 13, 2010 11:09 am

Sir engrjhez

Like I said no direct prohibition except splitting of contracts. However if the PE could justify that there is no splitting of contracts due to the fact that such insufficiency is unforeseen. Under the provision of Splitting of Contracts it provides that splitting of contracts is dividing 1 contract to several subcontracts for purposes of circumventing the requirements of the law and the IRR.

Wala namang cicumvention of the law dahil within the 25% limit parin naman po.

engrjhez wrote:A suggested cure to meet your suggestion will be doing it by one Repeat Order (full 25%) but allowing partial payments on partial deliveries. If the full quantity will be consumed, ok lang. If not, ok din kasi hindi naman sila babayaran in full for partial deliveries.

question ko lng po ung award ng repeat order, nakalagay ung contract or the repeat order itself at ABC, pwede bang conditional ung contract of repeat order? Ang alam ko po pag may ABC at na award na dapat the whole amount of the award should be given to the Bidder.

Siguro po pwede ung idea ni sir engrjhez, pero dapat magkarron nalang ng termination of contract of the repeat order pag sufficient na ung items deliviered, kasi kung ang mangyayari ay partial delivery and payment without terminating the contract it might end up in a civil litigation kasi ready pang mag deliver ung Bidder.


Last edited by Ligaw na Binatog on Tue Apr 13, 2010 6:05 pm; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : mali ung name na na quote ko)

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Re: REPEAT ORDER

Post by charlie brown on Tue Apr 13, 2010 12:50 pm

marriola wrote:hola!
how many times can we conduct repeat order?
thanks in advance

My long held position on the repeat order is that it should be done only once. however, upon closer rereview (naka ilang review na kasi) i am now inclined to change my position. It would seem indeed that the repeat order can be done cummulatively as long as it does not violate the other requirements. As to the obvious possibility of being accused of splitting this cannot be a certainty unless it can be proven that there was a prior intent to do a repeat order either once or several times. if the repeat order really became a necessity out of the demand of the circumstances then a repeat and another repeat order maybe in order - again as long as the other requirements are not violated. If the intent of the law was to limit it to one time it could have said so clearly in the provision.
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Re: REPEAT ORDER

Post by riddler on Tue Apr 13, 2010 5:52 pm

amen charlie brown. kampi na tayo dito. Very Happy
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Re: REPEAT ORDER

Post by riddler on Tue Apr 13, 2010 5:56 pm

Ligaw na Binatog wrote:Sir engrjhez

" x x x x x .

riddler wrote:A suggested cure to meet your suggestion will be doing it by one Repeat Order (full 25%) but allowing partial payments on partial deliveries. If the full quantity will be consumed, ok lang. If not, ok din kasi hindi naman sila babayaran in full for partial deliveries.

di na ata ako nag quote nyan LNB, di si ba engrjhez yun? ha ha ha. lol!


Last edited by riddler on Tue Apr 13, 2010 6:06 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Re: REPEAT ORDER

Post by Guest on Tue Apr 13, 2010 6:05 pm

Change ko na po

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Re: REPEAT ORDER

Post by sunriser431 on Tue Apr 13, 2010 9:33 pm

charlie brown wrote:
marriola wrote:hola!
how many times can we conduct repeat order?
thanks in advance

My long held position on the repeat order is that it should be done only once. however, upon closer rereview (naka ilang review na kasi) i am now inclined to change my position. It would seem indeed that the repeat order can be done cummulatively as long as it does not violate the other requirements. As to the obvious possibility of being accused of splitting this cannot be a certainty unless it can be proven that there was a prior intent to do a repeat order either once or several times. if the repeat order really became a necessity out of the demand of the circumstances then a repeat and another repeat order maybe in order - again as long as the other requirements are not violated. If the intent of the law was to limit it to one time it could have said so clearly in the provision.
agree bounce
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Re: REPEAT ORDER

Post by engrjhez® on Wed Apr 14, 2010 1:11 am

Ligaw na Binatog wrote:...
Siguro po pwede ung idea ni sir engrjhez, pero dapat magkarron nalang ng termination of contract of the repeat order pag sufficient na ung items deliviered, kasi kung ang mangyayari ay partial delivery and payment without terminating the contract it might end up in a civil litigation kasi ready pang mag deliver ung Bidder.

Since Repeat Order is under alternative methods, the prescribed Contract Agreement (as well as the GCC/SCC) in the PBD does not necessarily apply. Here is where simplicity and art comes into play:

Award is served for the maximum allowed (25% of each item). As part of the contract, only items requested and delivered shall be subject for payment. That is, when we need several items, have them delivered and have them billed for that purpose. If another set of items are required, have them delivered by the supplier, and then be paid for that delivery. This can be done several times until the whole quantity is consumed. If in the end of budget year, the items contracted under Repeat Order is not fully consumed, no problem at all kasi yung balanse ay hindi naman binayaran ng gobyerno. This system will work in the same way everyone wanted it to be (as cumulative Repeat Orders). Again, what's the difference? One posting, one procurement, one award, one contract. Progress billings will be simpler than several procurements under the same Repeat Order. Hindi ba't mas simple? Me contrary ba sa law if ever contracted this way?

Of course everybody can still do it the tedious way. Multiple postings, multiple procurements, multiple award, multiple contract (kahit under the same contractor). It is just a matter of doing it the hard way or the easy way, and still get the same end results. Very Happy
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Re: REPEAT ORDER

Post by marriola on Wed Apr 14, 2010 10:15 am

Hola damas y caballeros
i personally believe that resorting to repeat order is advantageous. I raised the question to determine if we can resort to repeat order several times within the period prescribed taking into consideration that the unit price of the original contract is advantageous. The example presented by engrjhez is quiet similar to our situation except that we have an excess amount from the abc of more than twenty five percent which can warrant a second repeat order.
Muchissimas gracias a todo. Hasta la vista
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