BAC Secretariat as a Separate Office/Unit

Go down

BAC Secretariat as a Separate Office/Unit Empty BAC Secretariat as a Separate Office/Unit

Post by engrjhez® on Thu Feb 19, 2009 1:13 am

A BAC Secretariat is created by the LCE composed of attending members from various non-procuremnet offices. If it is later recognized as separate office or unit that will be given personnel with plantilla under it (say it will now have its own permanent employees), is it still legally and ethically acceptable to retain all of its "attending" member(s) performing the very same functions and structure with the "new" members?

May i draw out your pulse on this?
engrjhez®
engrjhez®
Grand Master
Grand Master

Male Number of posts : 2485
Age : 40
Company/Agency : City Government of Bacoor [Region IV-A, Province of Cavite]
Occupation/Designation : City Administrator's Office / Certified National Trainer - PhilGEPS
Registration date : 2008-10-31

http://www.bacoor.gov.ph

Back to top Go down

BAC Secretariat as a Separate Office/Unit Empty BAC Secretariat as a Separate Office/Unit

Post by venom.0420 on Fri Feb 20, 2009 11:26 am

Sir, this one could be one good alternative than an increase in Honoraria. It may even be more effective. The problem with the current set-up is that the BAC secretariat, like the BAC members, are also working on a part-time basis. If there are permanent and full time employees working the details of the procurement process, there will be lesser errors and lesser risks to worry on our part as members of the BAC.

However, if there are already full time and permanent emloyees in the secretariat, I don't think there would still be a need for the services of the "attending" members. The BAC secretariat, if separated, should still be under the procurement section.
venom.0420
venom.0420
Active Poster
Active Poster

Male Number of posts : 98
Company/Agency : Government
Occupation/Designation : Government Employee
Registration date : 2009-01-05

Back to top Go down

BAC Secretariat as a Separate Office/Unit Empty Re: BAC Secretariat as a Separate Office/Unit

Post by engrjhez® on Sat Feb 21, 2009 12:28 am

venom.0420 wrote:Sir, this one could be one good alternative than an increase in Honoraria. It may even be more effective. The problem with the current set-up is that the BAC secretariat, like the BAC members, are also working on a part-time basis. If there are permanent and full time employees working the details of the procurement process, there will be lesser errors and lesser risks to worry on our part as members of the BAC.
Thank you for your comment. I must agree this is supposed to be more effective and efficient that the "attending" setup. But expertise and dedication are sometimes very-hard-to-find-out quality of the personnel for the job. Usually, when we are being paid for what we do, we tend to be less efficient. The idea of honoraria for attending members, however, boosts extra proficiency from the fact that we receive "additional compensation". Can we really conclude a full-time effort is more effective as equivalent collective effort? [ex. one (1) full time personnel vs. four (4) attending members?]

venom.0420 wrote:However, if there are already full time and permanent emloyees in the secretariat, I don't think there would still be a need for the services of the "attending" members. The BAC secretariat, if separated, should still be under the procurement section.

I would comment on your last sentence: The proposal that if BAC-Secretariat is separated, it shall be treated as a different unit. It can never be under the procurement section, but its members may come from that section (not entitled for honoraria in that case). Member proficiency and budget are factors but they dont always suggest the best blend.

To be back in the topic, can we maintain full time Secretariat members with attending members working efficiently altogether?
engrjhez®
engrjhez®
Grand Master
Grand Master

Male Number of posts : 2485
Age : 40
Company/Agency : City Government of Bacoor [Region IV-A, Province of Cavite]
Occupation/Designation : City Administrator's Office / Certified National Trainer - PhilGEPS
Registration date : 2008-10-31

http://www.bacoor.gov.ph

Back to top Go down

BAC Secretariat as a Separate Office/Unit Empty BAC Secretariat as a Separate Office/Unit

Post by RDV @ GP3i on Mon Feb 23, 2009 11:32 am

As part of the professionalization call of the law (Sec. 16) and in line with the standardization of procurement processes (Sec. 6), it is really best if an organic office would be designated or created to act as the BAC Secretariat. Once created/designated, I don't see the need for "attending" members performing parallel function. It could even created confusion among and between them. Of course, procurement proficiency should be considered by the HOPE in the designation. If not yet proficient on procurement, they can always attend procurement trainings conducted under the auspices of the GPPB.
RDV @ GP3i
RDV @ GP3i
Grand Master
Grand Master

Male Number of posts : 1611
Company/Agency : DBM-Reg'l Office IV-B
Occupation/Designation : Regional Director/ Procurement Trainer
Registration date : 2008-09-04

http://gppphil.org/

Back to top Go down

BAC Secretariat as a Separate Office/Unit Empty Re: BAC Secretariat as a Separate Office/Unit

Post by engrjhez® on Mon Feb 23, 2009 10:09 pm

Thanks RDV.

Based on your statement (as also referring to the IRR), it is "encouraged" that the LCE create a separate BAC Secretariat for the job, but "attending members" are also allowed if this is not possible. The rule is silent in case when both shall be accomodated. Proficiency, although a mandate of the law, also requires integrity of its members as well as other characteristics which may only be attained in a hybrid-setup.

If there is no prohibition for this hybrid-setup, can we conclude that this is permitted?
engrjhez®
engrjhez®
Grand Master
Grand Master

Male Number of posts : 2485
Age : 40
Company/Agency : City Government of Bacoor [Region IV-A, Province of Cavite]
Occupation/Designation : City Administrator's Office / Certified National Trainer - PhilGEPS
Registration date : 2008-10-31

http://www.bacoor.gov.ph

Back to top Go down

BAC Secretariat as a Separate Office/Unit Empty Re: BAC Secretariat as a Separate Office/Unit

Post by RDV @ GP3i on Tue Feb 24, 2009 5:19 pm

engrjhez wrote:Based on your statement (as also referring to the IRR), it is "encouraged" that the LCE create a separate BAC Secretariat for the job, but "attending members" are also allowed if this is not possible. The rule is silent in case when both shall be accomodated. Proficiency, although a mandate of the law, also requires integrity of its members as well as other characteristics which may only be attained in a hybrid-setup.
If there is no prohibition for this hybrid-setup, can we conclude that this is permitted?

Whether "proficiency", "integrity", "professionalization" may only be attained in a "hybrid-setup" is still debatable. It may apply to some, but as a general rule, it should not be recommended.
RDV @ GP3i
RDV @ GP3i
Grand Master
Grand Master

Male Number of posts : 1611
Company/Agency : DBM-Reg'l Office IV-B
Occupation/Designation : Regional Director/ Procurement Trainer
Registration date : 2008-09-04

http://gppphil.org/

Back to top Go down

BAC Secretariat as a Separate Office/Unit Empty BAC Secretariat as a separate office/unit

Post by dlsn on Wed Feb 25, 2009 8:53 am

While it is indeed debatable whether a "hybrid-setup" is better than pure organic or pure ad hoc type, considering that the IRR-A is silent on the legality of creating a BAC Secretariat through a "hybrid-setup", would you agree to recommend it for consideration in the Draft IRR? If yes, then I will move this topic to the forum on Draft GPRA IRR.
dlsn
dlsn
Moderator
Moderator

Male Number of posts : 52
Company/Agency : GPPB-TSO
Occupation/Designation : Deputy Executive Director
Registration date : 2008-07-01

Back to top Go down

BAC Secretariat as a Separate Office/Unit Empty Re: BAC Secretariat as a Separate Office/Unit

Post by engrjhez® on Wed Feb 25, 2009 5:17 pm

dlsn:

Thanks, i think will have to move the topic to the discussion on the Draft IRR.

Out of this topic question...how do we get "stars" below our avatars? Very Happy And how can we elevate a "new member" to a "regular member"?
engrjhez®
engrjhez®
Grand Master
Grand Master

Male Number of posts : 2485
Age : 40
Company/Agency : City Government of Bacoor [Region IV-A, Province of Cavite]
Occupation/Designation : City Administrator's Office / Certified National Trainer - PhilGEPS
Registration date : 2008-10-31

http://www.bacoor.gov.ph

Back to top Go down

BAC Secretariat as a Separate Office/Unit Empty "Hybrid-Setup" BAC Secretariat

Post by engrjhez® on Thu Feb 26, 2009 8:29 pm

There was a discussion under General Considerations

http://gppb.forumotion.com/general-considerations-f7/bac-secretariat-as-a-separate-office-unit-t33.htm

about a "hybrid-setup" in the BAC Secretariat. The moderator, dlsn, suggested moving this topic on the Draft IRR forum.
dlsn wrote:While it is indeed debatable whether a "hybrid-setup" is better than pure organic or pure ad hoc type, considering that the IRR-A is silent on the legality of creating a BAC Secretariat through a "hybrid-setup", would you agree to recommend it for consideration in the Draft IRR? If yes, then I will move this topic to the forum on Draft GPRA IRR.

But going back to Section 14:

"14.1. The head of the procuring entity shall create a Secretariat which will serve as the main support unit of the BAC. He may also designate an existing organic office within the said procuring entity to serve as Secretariat. However, to strengthen and promote the professionalization of the organizations’ procuring unit, he may reorganize this unit by designating it as BAC Secretariat and redeploying appropriate existing personnel to it to perform this function, as well as procurement related task... x x x"


This to me, indicates that the law isn't silent to a hybrid setup anyway. But for the purposes of amending the IRR, may I suggest this be emphasized by sub-sections:

14.1. The head of the procuring entity shall create a Secretariat which will serve as
the main support unit of the BAC. In designating its members he may:

    a) designate an existing organic office within the said procuring entity to serve as Secretariat; or,

    b) redeploy appropriate existing personnel to collectively act as attending members of the Secretariat; or,

    c) combine an existing organic office with appropriate attending members to perform the functions of the Secretariat;

In deciding which setup shall be adopted, consideration must be made to strengthen and promote the professionalization of the organizations’ procuring unit.


I hope this issue is wanting. Very Happy
engrjhez®
engrjhez®
Grand Master
Grand Master

Male Number of posts : 2485
Age : 40
Company/Agency : City Government of Bacoor [Region IV-A, Province of Cavite]
Occupation/Designation : City Administrator's Office / Certified National Trainer - PhilGEPS
Registration date : 2008-10-31

http://www.bacoor.gov.ph

Back to top Go down

BAC Secretariat as a Separate Office/Unit Empty Re: BAC Secretariat as a Separate Office/Unit

Post by Sponsored content


Sponsored content


Back to top Go down

Back to top

- Similar topics

 
Permissions in this forum:
You cannot reply to topics in this forum